Share your story of 18,000lbs!

[mrhtbd]

Anybody remember IcoPro, “You Gotta Want It,” sponsored by Fred Hatfield (“Dr Squat”) circa 1992? Well, he was influentual to me along with a long line of “Volume Trainers” over the years. Working his IcoPro training program at US Air Force Jet Engine Training School in 1993 I did 10x12 standing calf raises with 600lbs; that was 72,000lbs for one exercise grouping, eventually doing 1005 freeweight for six full reps, but that’s not the point. The point here is many people who have trained using volume training have done so much work over the years. We generally don’t respond to three sets of this or three sets a that, we need volume in order to recondition all those muscles we built over decades. To us, volume is is necessary! That’s where I am at this point in my life, one week before my 61st birthday. You may know, a month ago I took a job delivering ice and was delivering 5000 to 8000 pounds per day. It was exhausting especially from sitting around for 3 months. Well, today was a new record we delivered four skids to one store, it took over five hours for two of us to unload and stack. Each of us handled 18,000 pounds of ice. I am very tired and sore; 8:30 ready for bed, but I’m gonna feel even better tomorrow! I was wondering, some of the old-timers out there who have been on the boards the past 15-18 years, I’d love to hear your stories of your 18,000 pound day so throw them out here for this Neophyte, inspire us with your time tested wisdom and efforts! I would like to add that in a month I lost 12 pounds, down to 265, and the new belt I bought a month ago I’ve already lost three belt loops (now I have to get out a drill and make new holes). But let’s hear some stories, I’m sure some of you Mike Mentzer, etc fans had 18,000lb days. Let’s hear some! Thanks!

[liftsiron]

i always did Volume training. Tried other methods but they just didn't get it for me.

[Dawgpound_Hank]

Anybody remember IcoPro, “You Gotta Want It,” sponsored by Fred Hatfield (“Dr Squat”) circa 1992? Well, he was influentual to me along with a long line of “Volume Trainers” over the years. Working his IcoPro training program at US Air Force Jet Engine Training School in 1993 I did 10x12 standing calf raises with 600lbs; that was 72,000lbs for one exercise grouping, eventually doing 1005 freeweight for six full reps, but that’s not the point. The point here is many people who have trained using volume training have done so much work over the years. We generally don’t respond to three sets of this or three sets a that, we need volume in order to recondition all those muscles we built over decades. To us, volume is is necessary! That’s where I am at this point in my life, one week before my 61st birthday. You may know, a month ago I took a job delivering ice and was delivering 5000 to 8000 pounds per day. It was exhausting especially from sitting around for 3 months. Well, today was a new record we delivered four skids to one store, it took over five hours for two of us to unload and stack. Each of us handled 18,000 pounds of ice. I am very tired and sore; 8:30 ready for bed, but I’m gonna feel even better tomorrow! I was wondering, some of the old-timers out there who have been on the boards the past 15-18 years, I’d love to hear your stories of your 18,000 pound day so throw them out here for this Neophyte, inspire us with your time tested wisdom and efforts! I would like to add that in a month I lost 12 pounds, down to 265, and the new belt I bought a month ago I’ve already lost three belt loops (now I have to get out a drill and make new holes). But let’s hear some stories, I’m sure some of you Mike Mentzer, etc fans had 18,000lb days. Let’s hear some! Thanks!

Couldn't disagree more with what's in bold. ^

You can take a lumberjack, carpenter or brick layer, who lifts 10's of thousands of pounds a day, and it isn't going to make them have big muscles.

You do 2 sets with me on an exercise, the way I train, no pacing yourself for 10 sets with light weights, no leaving 2 reps in the tank bcoz you know you have many more sets to do. But go ALL out until you absolutely cannot get another rep - in the 10 to 12 rep range, then a couple forced reps on top of it. It's physically impossible to do many sets like that, and counterproductive even if one could. You reallly have to have your mind in the right spot to train this way, but if you do, it's a very effective and efficient way of building muscle and you don't need to be in the gym a long time to do it.

[Dawgpound_Hank]

Btw wasn't trying to sway you from being a volume guy haha - I know that's impossible as you've always dug it. Mainly just pointing out that 3 sets of an exercise is definitely enough if done the right way.

A quick example - my chest workout yesterday. Pyramidding up in weight each set, last set being the heaviest:

incline bb press - 30, 30, 15, 10, 10*, 7*
flat db press - 12, 10*, 8*
incline db flyes - 12, 10*, 8*
standing cable flyes - 20*, 15*

* = work-sets

The 2 sets of 30 on incline is with bar only. I got a fuqqed right RC, so have to warm-up extra good before adding weight.

Rest times on first 2 exercises is around 3 mins on the work-sets, so to be fully recovered to use maximum weights being these are the Mac Daddy, mass building movements. On last 2 exercises, it's brief, as soon as my partner goes, I go, then he goes, etc, so maybe 45-60 secs. Good way to end with a maximal pump.

That's only 2 work sets on each exercise and our pecs were fried. First work-set of each exercise is done to positive failure. Last work-set is done to positive failure, with my partner helping me eek out 2 forced reps. No forced reps on cable flyes, just positive failure (sounds rather oxymoronic eh? ).

[Roughrydr]

I think we've had a very similar discussion before. Busting your butt st work and busting your butt in the gym do not produce the same results. When weight training you are isolating a specific muscle group with a repetitive motion which tears the muscle making it produce scar tissue which increases muscle mass. At work while you may be developing strength and overall muscle coordination you don't develop the same muscle mass because you are not isolating.
I know you know all this already and I'm guessing I missed the point of the thread.
If it's about hard days at work, many of us here can relate to getting the job done by putting your body through the ringer. I should have stayed in college, and you should have kicked that young black girls butt back in the classroom.

[Dawgpound_Hank]

Bwhahaha @ the young black girl! Wasn't it a pencil through the forearm?

I think mrhtbd needs to track her down and solo-riot in front of her house holding a WLM sign.

[mrhtbd]

I agree with both you guys definitely can’t build any kind of muscle doing multiple volume, just conditioning. Hank is dead on but I think with all my injuries I’m trying to get an overall positive level of conditioning so that I could actually move around and increase mobility. At my age this is a priority. This job is doing that if I were to add quality muscle later on this is the start on a way to get there. Concerning the kid who stabbed me with the pen; he was half black half Spanish and half retarded. I took him down with a judo move without injury and waited for the cops to cuff him. The 260lb girl; I did grab her by the neck and slammed her down smashing her head into the concrete, oh the look on her face when it did so was priceless, but being surrounded by 20 other kids I decided no further action requiredit and made my exit. Smartly, I got away from that job while I could and now can live on a partial pension for 20 more years. I’ll be 61 on Friday and at this point I’m just trying to get some clarity around my life again. (Plus a blue-eyed Russian bride, if for no other reason than to piss off my Finnish ex-wife)!😁👍😎

[HDH]

Couldn't disagree more with what's in bold. ^

You can take a lumberjack, carpenter or brick layer, who lifts 10's of thousands of pounds a day, and it isn't going to make them have big muscles.

You do 2 sets with me on an exercise, the way I train, no pacing yourself for 10 sets with light weights, no leaving 2 reps in the tank bcoz you know you have many more sets to do. But go ALL out until you absolutely cannot get another rep - in the 10 to 12 rep range, then a couple forced reps on top of it. It's physically impossible to do many sets like that, and counterproductive even if one could. You reallly have to have your mind in the right spot to train this way, but if you do, it's a very effective and efficient way of building muscle and you don't need to be in the gym a long time to do it.

You may be surprised what you can work yourself up to. My training is crazy volume, 3 to 5 exercises are a single set for me and range from 20 to 40 reps per exercise. That's ranges from 60 to 200 reps per set with the exception of leg day, I will hit some singles because of the need for a hip replacement.

Training sessions for me are 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 hours long. The second half I'm doing everything to failure. This type of training is really paying off these last couple of years. I continue to grow as long as I put enough food in me. Some guys will try volume and not eat the extra cals they are burning. I tracked mine and added until I grew.

If I wasn't eating enough to get fat, I wasn't eating enough to gain muscle. If someone tries volume and the scale doesn't change, it's a lack of food. I've never heard anyone say they tried volume, ate a ton and started getting fat. We are resilient and adapt. I certainly didn't do it overnight. It's a program I've been pushing and challenging for a few years.

I'm sure I would respond well to heavier weights, I just can't anymore. The supps really help an older fella out too

[Dawgpound_Hank]

You may be surprised what you can work yourself up to. My training is crazy volume, 3 to 5 exercises are a single set for me and range from 20 to 40 reps per exercise. That's ranges from 60 to 200 reps per set with the exception of leg day, I will hit some singles because of the need for a hip replacement.

Training sessions for me are 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 hours long. The second half I'm doing everything to failure. This type of training is really paying off these last couple of years. I continue to grow as long as I put enough food in me. Some guys will try volume and not eat the extra cals they are burning. I tracked mine and added until I grew.

If I wasn't eating enough to get fat, I wasn't eating enough to gain muscle. If someone tries volume and the scale doesn't change, it's a lack of food. I've never heard anyone say they tried volume, ate a ton and started getting fat. We are resilient and adapt. I certainly didn't do it overnight. It's a program I've been pushing and challenging for a few years.

I'm sure I would respond well to heavier weights, I just can't anymore. The supps really help an older fella out too

Oh I get what your saying amigo. But what I'm saying is one cannot train hard AND long both. It's just simple logic, as easy as 2 + 2 haha. Now the guy that claims he IS in fact training "hard", for a long duration, and or high volume, is training hard according to his definition of hard, but he actually could be training MUCH harder if training briefer and/or doing less.

[HDH]

Oh I get what your saying amigo. But what I'm saying is one cannot train hard AND long both. It's just simple logic, as easy as 2 + 2 haha. Now the guy that claims he IS in fact training "hard", for a long duration, and or high volume, is training hard according to his definition of hard, but he actually could be training MUCH harder if training briefer and/or doing less.

When you say train hard and long are you saying heavy weights and long?

I guess I'm not understanding how someone could train much harder by training brief and/or doing less.

In the end it sounds like what we are talking about both go to failure so a I have to throw the question, is getting in and out of the gym working with heavy weight to failure much harder than twice as long at the gym with the same failure?

Maybe the intensity is higher in a shorter period but unless you have done both successfully, it would really be hard to tell.

And maybe I'm just reading this wrong

[Dawgpound_Hank]

When you say train hard and long are you saying heavy weights and long?

I guess I'm not understanding how someone could train much harder by training brief and/or doing less.

In the end it sounds like what we are talking about both go to failure so a I have to throw the question, is getting in and out of the gym working with heavy weight to failure much harder than twice as long at the gym with the same failure?

Maybe the intensity is higher in a shorter period but unless you have done both successfully, it would really be hard to tell.

And maybe I'm just reading this wrong

I'm talking about giving absolutely everything one has to a set. Not only going to positive failure, but beyond, via forced reps, and negative failure too. It goes without saying that one cannot do as much volume with that amount of intensity. One cannot equate working hard and working long - they are complete opposites.

Easy way to see what I'm talking about is go watch Yates vid Blood N Guts sometime. Then go watch some of Jays old training vids when he was prime. Jay worked MUCH longer than Yates, but Yates worked MUCH harder than Jay. Hence, Jay could get away with doing 20-25 sets for bis, and up to 40 sets for back, where Yates did 3 sets for bis and 6 sets for back. Yet both were great with each's own style.

Btw I'm not by any means saying training HIT is THEE best way to train. We all gotta find what works best for us to deliver results (cliche I know). I just know that this way works great for me and has for many years. I've tried about every style that's out there in my 43 years with the iron, and for ME, HIT is best for getting results. As long as my old body holds up, that is.

[HDH]

I've understood you correctly. My whole routine is based on the advanced training principals from Arnold's Encyclopedia. I'm doing what your doing at the end but still getting in the volume. I'm soaked from head to toe and run circles around everyone in the gym.

I run circles around guys that run circles around guys. You are the same way, I can tell by your posts. I don't usually put it out like that but it's the only way you will understand, I'm usually pretty humble about my work ethic. You can tell we are both still hungry. We both started off later in life and still have the drive.

Could your average guy do what you do? Doubtful.

Same goes for me.

I'm talking about giving absolutely everything one has to a set. Not only going to positive failure, but beyond, via forced reps, and negative failure too. It goes without saying that one cannot do as much volume with that amount of intensity. One cannot equate working hard and working long - they are complete opposites.

Easy way to see what I'm talking about is go watch Yates vid Blood N Guts sometime. Then go watch some of Jays old training vids when he was prime. Jay worked MUCH longer than Yates, but Yates worked MUCH harder than Jay. Hence, Jay could get away with doing 20-25 sets for bis, and up to 40 sets for back, where Yates did 3 sets for bis and 6 sets for back. Yet both were great with each's own style.

Btw I'm not by any means saying training HIT is THEE best way to train. We all gotta find what works best for us to deliver results (cliche I know). I just know that this way works great for me and has for many years. I've tried about every style that's out there in my 43 years with the iron, and for ME, HIT is best for getting results. As long as my old body holds up, that is.

[Dawgpound_Hank]

I've understood you correctly. My whole routine is based on the advanced training principals from Arnold's Encyclopedia. I'm doing what your doing at the end but still getting in the volume. I'm soaked from head to toe and run circles around everyone in the gym.

I run circles around guys that run circles around guys. You are the same way, I can tell by your posts. I don't usually put it out like that but it's the only way you will understand, I'm usually pretty humble about my work ethic. You can tell we are both still hungry. We both started off later in life and still have the drive.

Could your average guy do what you do? Doubtful.

Same goes for me.

Well put!

Indeed I've prolly been the hardest training guy in any gym I've ever trained. Perhaps that's why I was able to get to 240 totally natty and relatively lean to boot. Well that, with some good genetics for putting on muscle.

When you say late starter, I guess you're referring to PEDs? If so, yeah, I was 40 when started. But I've been hitting the iron religiously since 14 y.o. I do have to admit I was never a hard gainer - I was able to get big pretty quick, relatively speaking. But I trained hard af and never skimped on nutrition. At 18 I was 230, and hovered between 230 and 240 for the next 22 years. Sometimes I wish I woulda did AAS much younger - maybe around 22. Just to see what I coulda did. Then again, who knows I might be dead by now or bad health. Hell I've been accused of being ON since 17 haha.

I think one of the things that helped is how you put it, I've ALWAYS remained hungry, and that is key. I never compared myself to local guys in the gym, or satisfied being the biggest dude in the gym. Fuck that. That's a big fish in a small pond. I always compared myself to the best, to the guys in the muscle mags, and hence, leaves a mindset of a TON of work that still needs to be done.

You and I have a lot in common. Two older fuckers who still kill it like we are 25 and outwork everyone in the room.

[HDH]

Ya man, I thought you started working out at 40, I didn't realize you had been at it for so long. I compare myself the same way so I'm never satisfied. I can't compare myself to these everyday gym guys because I don't want to look like them. When I started being bigger or leaner or best conditioned it still didn't matter because it's still not where I want to be.

I think part of me staying longer at the gym is because there's really no place I'd rather be. I do push the boundaries on my training and most would think I couldn't grow but I'm steady growing. I thought I always had the fat guy genes but perhaps they are better than I think.

Well put!

Indeed I've prolly been the hardest training guy in any gym I've ever trained. Perhaps that's why I was able to get to 240 totally natty and relatively lean to boot. Well that, with some good genetics for putting on muscle.

When you say late starter, I guess you're referring to PEDs? If so, yeah, I was 40 when started. But I've been hitting the iron religiously since 14 y.o. I do have to admit I was never a hard gainer - I was able to get big pretty quick, relatively speaking. But I trained hard af and never skimped on nutrition. At 18 I was 230, and hovered between 230 and 240 for the next 22 years. Sometimes I wish I woulda did AAS much younger - maybe around 22. Just to see what I coulda did. Then again, who knows I might be dead by now or bad health. Hell I've been accused of being ON since 17 haha.

I think one of the things that helped is how you put it, I've ALWAYS remained hungry, and that is key. I never compared myself to local guys in the gym, or satisfied being the biggest dude in the gym. Fuck that. That's a big fish in a small pond. I always compared myself to the best, to the guys in the muscle mags, and hence, leaves a mindset of a TON of work that still needs to be done.

You and I have a lot in common. Two older fuckers who still kill it like we are 25 and outwork everyone in the room.