opinions for cycle 4

[bufbiker]

Emil, what does your diet look like? Do you have any problems getting enough whole foods with protein, like chicken, pork or beef?

[andrew0409]

Emil, what does your diet look like? Do you have any problems getting enough whole foods with protein, like chicken, pork or beef?

That's what I want to know also. If you are training, you should not be gaining bf unless you are especially trying to even without gear in your system. With gear in your system, especially tren, there is no reason to be gaining bf.

[Emil]

Well i don t think i have a problem to get enough protein: i eat a lot of chicken, beef , fish and pork. Somewere arrownd 200grams/day.
The problem i belive is with carbs..when i m bulking i tend to take huge amounts of fast carbs like bread, fries, pizza, ice cream and other sweat sugar things. i belive is arownd 350-400 gr/day
Also if i have to eat 5-6 meals per day i tend to get so much fats: from meat, chese , popcorn, nachos. maybe 130-200 grams.
It s about 3700-4300 cals / day less or more depends on training days, protein shake (one or 2 /day), if i travel, and so on...

The new plan is to eat more clean and less this cycle. I have never been on AAS and stay on maintenance calorie or on calorie deficit. just curious how my body will react.
Also, i have a BIG problem when i came out...i eat the same amounts of calorie and i gain a lot of fat (just i m afraid of loosing all the hard gained muscle...and i end at 16-18 % bf from 9-10% bf at the begining of the cycle.)

[bufbiker]

So you need to be more disciplined with your diet or you might as well drop the short esters and just do a deca/test cycle.
I've discovered that to bulk you don't have to eat that much more. Just eat three sensible meals a day and snack on chicken breast (weighed out to 4-6 ounces is plenty) or some other form of lean protein a couple of times a day. For fats eat almonds, or something you can get easily. The bread you need to cut out. I eat potatoes once a day, but no chips, cookies, ice cream etc. The tren is not going to help you in the long run if your diet is doritos and energy drinks (just an example).

[Emil]

I tell the story of how i was...not how i m....i m very determinated to diet hard this cycle. If i m aible to cut down frm 18 to 10% bf i should be aible to build muscle without fat on a strict diat.
I will write down everything i eat...and i wil adjust when necessary. I m really focused this time.

[andrew0409]

My opinion,
gram of test, 200-400mg of tren, 100mg of var ed if you want serious clean gains after reading what you want to do.

[bufbiker]

My opinion,
gram of test, 200-400mg of tren, 100mg of var ed if you want serious clean gains after reading what you want to do.

I like this as well. Sides can be controlled with aromas in and caber.

[Emil]

One big question?...what is better on cycle: arimidex or aromasin?
I always use on cycle arimidex.
But ...my latest untrusted resarch tell me that i should use aromasin...less sides..less stres on the liver..
I just don t know if it is true that aromasin is far better than arimidex

[Acneman]

My opinion,
gram of test, 200-400mg of tren, 100mg of var ed if you want serious clean gains after reading what you want to do.

ok thats over 2 grams of gear a week. one gram of tes, 400 mg of of tren and 700mg of var. does a 180lb guy really need that to grow? he was proposing less than a gram a week in wrong proportions of course but still much lower dosess.

hey i just cant agree with that. that is a pro level cycle in my opinion. i have never run that high.

let me propose some negatives to that. studies have shown that tendon and ligament growth during steroid use is impaired due to uneven growth of those tissues. this is how you get serious injuries... when your strength and muscles out grow your connective tissue growth and strength. then there is cardiac remodeling and other long term sides of heavy juicing.

and this one is the kicker. once you go this heavy, normal cycles will never be enough.

i understand the more is better philosophy but in all honesty sometimes less is more.

i would recommend 500mg tes and 250/300 mg deca or tren for his cycle. that is all a guy his size needs (if not more than he needs). like i said in my thirties i grew huge on that cycle and was working my ass off every day at a physical job.

before i would recommend a dose like that you would have to be over 250lbs and low body fat. like 10 to maybe 15% or less. over 30, and making benches and squats that made children cry to watch. this guy is 180 with 16 percent body fat. so minus the fat thats 152 bs of meat blood and bone. and you are recommending over 2 grams of juice? and 700mgs of that a hepatoxic oral that is at twice the dose that most amateurs use? for how long andrew?

jesus guys really?

this overkill.

im not trying to start a fight i just want you guys to think about what you are saying.

if your son had his stats what would you say to him? 'shoot the wad son. better dead than skinny"

i challenge anyone on this board to justify 2 grams of gear for this guy.

[Emil]

Agree with you acneman...but i m 180 pounds 78kg but not 16%bf......i m less then 10%bf...still wait answers for arimidex..aromasin problem

[andrew0409]

I would not call this cycle heavy. I'd rather he has the test to grow and since he seems to really want to run tren, I lowered the dosage to a much reasonable range. Hes already put tren in his body. IMO you should not run tren at all until a couple cycles later. I very clearly said Test and Var. So if he's determine to run something like this, I think what I'm suggesting is not too crazy. Var is mild enough to run at that dose for me.

[andrew0409]

One big question?...what is better on cycle: arimidex or aromasin?
I always use on cycle arimidex.
But ...my latest untrusted resarch tell me that i should use aromasin...less sides..less stres on the liver..
I just don t know if it is true that aromasin is far better than arimidex

I used to run adex, but it kills my sex drive too much. So I switched to nolva now. But adex for you, unless you are extremely sensitive to gyno.

[bufbiker]

The idea that once you go heavy you can't go back so to speak is not correct. All of the vets here used to run ridiculous, massive cycles but as we've gotten older we've found that less is actually better over the long run.
Aromas in is good to use on cycle because it kills estrogen so to speak instead of suppressing it (my non scientific explanation) so there is no rebound effect from it later.

[andrew0409]

The idea that once you go heavy you can't go back so to speak is not correct. All of the vets here used to run ridiculous, massive cycles but as we've gotten older we've found that less is actually better over the long run.
Aromas in is good to use on cycle because it kills estrogen so to speak instead of suppressing it (my non scientific explanation) so there is no rebound effect from it later.

If adex was messing with my sex drive, I feel like killing estrogen receptors would have make it way worst. You are right on no rebound, but rebound can easily be prevented. I still believe Arom should be the last line of defense against estrogen sides.

[Emil]

I will go with aromasin...Adex in generaly don t mess with my sex drive.
In fact i m horrny all the time when i use it wit AAS.
That s been said yesteray at 5pm a order the test prop, tren hexa and NNP, in the other part of the country. And today it was delivered to me at 1pm..in the middle of High Court of Justice....goood country ..
Monday i will begin,....feal a little nervous about run 2 nandrolones in the same time,but i will give it a try.